There Are No EV Chargers At The US Capitol with Hilary Haron

Paul J Daly: 0:00

Michael, have you been to Washington DC yet?

‍Unknown: 0:07

This is Auto Collabs. I have.

Paul J Daly: 0:10

Yeah. What was your first tell us about your first trip to Washington DC as a now, US resident?

Michael Cirillo: 0:17

Well, I went when I was not yet a US resident. So I was enamored by all of it. I was like, oh, man, this Mr. Gates. Yeah, exactly. I was like,

Paul J Daly: 0:25

Canada does that kind of thing.

Michael Cirillo: 0:28

And then I was like, Wait, am I in Europe? Or am I in America? Because this all looks like France right now. Really? Yeah. Because,

Kyle Mountsier: 0:37

you know, where's

Michael Cirillo: 0:37

the Washington monument that looks exactly like where Marie Antoinette like. So basically, the

Kyle Mountsier: 0:42

low we wanted to be France back when we built us, right.

Michael Cirillo: 0:46

That whole like passageway, right to the Abe Lincoln Memorial, like even the water, yep, water. Everything like the Abe Lincoln Memorial would essentially be the Arc de Triomphe in Paris. But it's just that so

Kyle Mountsier: 1:00

it but in the Psalms li Ze is the big pool.

Michael Cirillo: 1:03

That's right. Exactly. Yep, exactly. But it was cool. I loved it. You know, what I what I love about Washington is there's definitely an energy shift there. Like I felt like I could feel a different energy in that city. Like there is stuff happening here. Yeah,

Paul J Daly: 1:16

I mean, today's guest Hilary Haron has actually spent a good bit of time advocating for dealers in Washington, DC, interesting to get her insights here. Also, multigenerational dealer. You know, all the all the ingredients for a great podcast. So we hope you enjoy this interview we have with Hillary. Hillary, thank you so much for joining us today on Auto Collabs.

Hilary Haron: 1:41

Thank you very much for having me. I'm excited to be here.

Paul J Daly: 1:44

So you kind of have an automotive career that has now really cycled one full gamut, as I would put it. So can you just summarize your journey in the auto industry like kind of from the beginning to like where you are now?

Hilary Haron: 1:59

I will do my best to keep it concise. So my grandfather, he was a mechanic, he can signed a car that that seemed a little bit easier than wrenching. He was a mechanic when it was traditional renting, right. And our family is Armenian. So at the time, there was quite a bit of persecution. And so that kind of set his goals lofty, and he was like, I don't want to be a used car dealer when a new car dealer so he kind of went about doing that. Got a few new car franchises settled with Jaguar brought Land Rover over over rover and then

Kyle Mountsier: 2:45

cosign the consign the car has a JLR Yeah, like, clearly a summary. All right, yeah.

Hilary Haron: 2:51

So my dad joined the business when he's in college. And my grandfather passed as my dad was acquiring the story from him. So my cousin and I got into the store, I worked there through high school through college. And, yeah, like that, that's the summary. I when I was pregnant with my daughter, wrote, let me take it back just just hit in 2015 cnca invited me with them to a lobbying trip in Washington DC, that kind of changed my life. And I found advocacy so fulfilling, especially because I look a little different than the people that they normally see doing advocacy, you know, you got to you got to earn your your age, your gray hairs whatever it is, so that you can leave the store and go do things. And I found that it was impactful. And when I was pregnant with my daughter I something like lit on fire in me and I was elected to the CNC EDA board I ran for the NADA board eventually was elected to the NADA board sat on our local central California New Car Dealership board. So that that's it in a that's the best I can do it summarizing apologies. Yeah,

Kyle Mountsier: 4:12

what I would love to hear is go back to that week or whatever it was with the CNC EDA and because I think people know people maybe know in their mind in the dealership world that okay, we have these 80 days working for us lobbying for could be any number of things. At any given time. Right now we know a lot of like EB conversations, affordability, all of that franchise laws is happening, right. But when you were there, what were the things that like the CN CDA and you were passionate about that had the impact on you in that week of advocacy.

Hilary Haron: 4:48

Um, so I don't know necessarily if it was the things that we were talking about as much as it was being able to relate to people and And, and kind of getting a feel for what it was like at the Capitol and why people find it so intimidating. Because once you're in it once you're there, you're like, Oh, why did I find why did why was I so nervous? Now I'm a natural introvert, I need to be by myself to recharge, I'm all of that everything else is learned, right? So and you learn and you can do it, but then you need, you know, you need your space to recharge. So I was scared out of my mind. But it really built me up to say, to tell myself, like, you may feel out of plays, and this may really suck can be uncomfortable, but you're doing it you're going and you're doing it anyway. And then, you know, Brian moss CNCS president, he's just a great guy. And his very, like level personality really kind of helped me like he, he's bounced all over the place. So it helped me like not get into my own feels. So at the time, I think we were talking about the CFPB and rules that they wanted to implement. And one, I got a couple people to sign on, which was, which was fantastic to get some co sponsors. But one of them was the most impactful conversation, I think, was with a staffer, like a younger staffer in a hallway explaining to them what would happen if they were trying to buy a car that had been grounded, because it had like a recall for a sticker on it. And what that would do to the price of cars, and you know where that person was in their life like relating it to them. And that young man saying, nobody's ever talked to me, like I matter. And nobody has ever explained it to me in a way that I could understand. And I was like, Well, I've never talked to anybody either. And I'm just as scared and freaked out. So yeah. I get goosebumps even thinking about that moment in, in a dingy weird hallway, you know. And that legislator signed on as a as a co sponsor. So that's what changed. That's what

Paul J Daly: 7:16

there's, there's a huge point in there. Because I don't know, Kyle, if you remember when we were talking about two, two, it was a, it was a dealer of a kid in Delaware, they were talking about the fact that most legislators don't have a lot of time to really look into the issues in the bills. And they're advised largely by younger staffers, who a lot of times are interns who also have believed like a pop culture narrative about our industry. And they aren't fully informed. They're actually just letting that pop culture narrative go through to their decision making. They're influencing and it sounds like what you just did was you just broke that chain, like legitimately to a support. Nobody has

Hilary Haron: 7:59

ever encapsulated that better than you just did. Like, that is the

Paul J Daly: 8:04

guy that said it to me, I'll remember. Right now,

Hilary Haron: 8:10

there's there's a lot of like, little anecdotes, or really long explanations, but that encapsulates it perfectly. The amount of bills that go across the floor, they don't have time to read about like, and as long as bills get. And then you have other things, you have other organizations that are trying to make rules that, you know, we're asking as dealers or consumers. We're asking them to pay attention to these other organizations that they're supposed to have oversight of, nobody has the capacity for that. So they they hire staffers that they think they align with. But the but a lot of times the staffers do have like a pop culture. And I don't want to say they have pop culture, politics, but they kind of have pop culture politics, like it's when you're when you're on your way

Kyle Mountsier: 8:57

of origin. It's just like, that's their story of origin for the automotive industry. They've never been told a different story, right? Well,

Hilary Haron: 9:04

some of them don't have cars, or some of them if they're purchased a car or,

Kyle Mountsier: 9:08

you know, DC, right? Yeah,

Michael Cirillo: 9:10

it's an essence as close as I've ever been to experiencing an episode of House of Cards in real life. Yes, done it. His

Paul J Daly: 9:24

name was Santosh Viswanathan.

Michael Cirillo: 9:27

I need to know, is it a total bloodbath down there? Like are they just just fighting each other over different things? They

Hilary Haron: 9:35

are terrible. And that's the problem is that what we see is so sensationalized what we what we are fed is to get an emotional reaction out of us, right, that's the only way they're gonna raise money from us. It's the only way that they're gonna get, you know, people to argue with each other and ignore what's really going on and without getting too far into my own political views. i It's not it's it's largely friendly. It's you Oh, you know, I was in a legislators office last year that your last September the September before tagging the chief of staff who I've become friends with and he was going to buy an Eevee and my opinion on EVs I have kept largely to myself, because I've represented organizations that are very supportive of it. But at the capital of every legislator, where to buy an Eevee, where are they going to charge it?

Kyle Mountsier: 10:24

Right, they capital, capital, and they don't have it?

Hilary Haron: 10:28

No, not, not in the US, not in California, like they don't have the infrastructure.

Michael Cirillo: 10:33

I'm excited you chose our short show to like, Finally, express your political views

Paul J Daly: 10:38

and run for office. Sounds great.

Hilary Haron: 10:45

And, and they, you know, we were talking about that, and they, both the Chief of Staff for his DC office and his California office were there. And they were like, you know, I didn't really think about it that way. And I was like, you know, why are we missing the boat on hybrids? This is like the transition technology, like, I get that we're shooting, you know, shooting for the other, the other world and hopefully landing somewhere acceptable,

Paul J Daly: 11:11

I guess. Golly, well, I didn't expect the conversation today.

Kyle Mountsier: 11:16

We were going there. I'm like, we're gonna I'm like, I gotta go to Capitol Hill. I got stories to tell

Hilary Haron: 11:24

people do you. I mean, are EVs

Michael Cirillo: 11:26

three miles away than getting a gas powered Uber to take them the rest of the way to the hill?

Hilary Haron: 11:31

Or what happens when you get stuck in that kind of traffic? I think this is something that works that practically we're going to run into in, especially in the big metros, which is where most of the EVs are. The traffic is crazy. And in my opinion, they're not the safety isn't there yet. And I think that those are things that need to be talked about at the Capitol, they don't know, how are they going to know that you need special safety equipment to treat an Eevee? Accident? Because until Mercedes did it, they had never published an accident report activities like and that was last year. Wow. You're not gonna know unless somebody goes and tells them.

Paul J Daly: 12:14

So what is your like? Tell tell the the little tail end of the story cow brought us back? Yeah. What is your position role in the auto industry right now what has happened over the last 12 months, things have changed a little bit

Hilary Haron: 12:25

they have. So we sold our store at the end or stores at the end of last year at the end of 2023. And what I'm doing now is I I'm a passionate advocate for the industry. So still having some of those conversations with legislators just not in the same capacity launch round podcast, really highlighting women in male dominated industries. Thank you, and other advocates. So it's not just about the the woman in the male dominated industry, but also about people who are making space for that, who see the value and who have practically seen it reflected in their bottom line. And that's, you know, that's, that's where I'm at right now.

Paul J Daly: 13:10

What's the podcast called?

Hilary Haron: 13:12

It's called a road less traveled. It's on YouTube, it's on anywhere, you get your podcast, Spotify,

Paul J Daly: 13:18

the road less traveled, go, we're gonna make sure people people find a way. That's why people don't give me things to do. Just tell me your show up?

Kyle Mountsier: 13:28

What's what, give us some insight into the conversations that you've had there? Because I'm sure you know, because it's multi vertical, right? You're not just looking at the automotive industry, there, there's probably been some insights because, you know, like around here at ASCO do more than cars, we definitely recognize that there are disparities in the working gap between the community and the employee set, right. And no matter what that community employees that make up is whether it's like, you know, a disparity in the gender gap, or the racial gap of the community to the employee set, right. That's like when we think about it, that's the map for us. What What are practical things that you're hearing or seeing, that people are doing to shorten that gap?

Hilary Haron: 14:16

So one of the things that impacted me is I wrote service for a while I was, you know, in the line, like online, greeting customers doing writing actual repair orders, doing the whole thing interacting with the shop. And it's be it's the people, it's the interaction with your clients, right? Because the goal is to have a happy public. I mean, overall, the overarching goal, happy mobile public. And when you see the difference, when like, for example, I had one woman walk in and she was visibly uncomfortable. And it turns out, you know, you find out later like somebody had talked down to her and you You know, somebody called her honey. And eventually, like, we had a pretty good relationship. And she felt comfortable with the way that I had explained things to her and, and I think some of that comes from the comfort, you know, comfort with the people you know, or people that look like you. That's pretty general, pretty general human behavior. But one of the things that when I was like said things changed, I was pregnant with my daughter, I got, I got real hifi. And what I got really, I got real hifi

Paul J Daly: 15:35

I've never heard that word in my life. What does that mean?

Hilary Haron: 15:37

I met it just aged myself quite a bit.

Paul J Daly: 15:42

They weren't gonna ask, Do you guys know? No clue.

Hilary Haron: 15:45

I'm not real jacked up on Mountain Dew like I was I got, you know, a fee. I

Paul J Daly: 15:51

could be a West Coast east coast. Put yourself in that bucket. Yeah,

Hilary Haron: 15:56

that that may be it. But I, you know, one of the goals that I had was to get a female in every department, you know, we had a female parts manager, we had female service writers, we had a female saleswoman, we had, you know, women in the business office, we had, we ended up with a female technician, one of the things that I had expressed to my partner was that, that was something that was important to me. And while I was out, you know, for the whole two weeks, I was out, we had a female mechanic apply or technician apply. And she ended up being the top performer, you know, so being able to like see it and implemented is one thing, something that I have heard that other dealers are doing that we did not have the opportunity to do is their working hours, they have changed the way that you're expected to work in those roles. They have changed pay plans, specifically related to you know, people with families and how they're paid and what the goals are, you know, I think those are all things that people need that we need to be looking at. And I will say that, in my experience, what I've seen is that most female mechanics, technicians that are very good, have gone independent. So we have to think about the way that we're playing paying technicians and the way that their working environment is, if they're good enough to go out on their own and be on their own when their own shops, why would we not want to cord them into ours like that? Right? Because

Paul J Daly: 17:29

that's not an easy thing to do? No, they can handle that, oh, yeah, should be able to take care of. So then

Hilary Haron: 17:35

we have to look at what's wrong with the environment. Because the pay is not that bad. Even on a regular pay, you know, the average person in the automotive industry makes $107,000 a year something like that. And that's the average, right? So what's the what's wrong with the environment? How do we change that? How do we get more in there? And I know, you know,

Paul J Daly: 17:57

time and time again, I'm

Hilary Haron: 17:58

sorry, I know, you're gonna go ahead.

Paul J Daly: 17:59

I was gonna say time and time again, we have seen and have so much exposure to dealers who have really embraced what you're talking about right now. And head and shoulders, have better reviews, retention, customer experience, better company culture, like head and shoulders. It's not even close. Whenever I got Episode Two was at a dealership called Beaver Toyota in coming Georgia. And they have specific intentionality towards exactly what you're talking about. Toyota of Marysville with another West Coast dealership, 50% of their staff, female throughout the entire dealership, and when you look at what they're able to accomplish, from a business sense, from a profit and loss sense from a retention sense, I mean, it just blows everybody else out of the water. So maybe it is an indicator like you're advocating for it here. But there are real business cases throughout our industry that prove it's a viable and desirable way forward.

Hilary Haron: 18:56

I mean, even if you look at the biggest companies in the world, their their bottom lines are reflective of it when their boards change when they're, I mean, not just the automotive industry, but think about where you shop. When you walk in, you don't want to feel like a leper. I mean, sorry, to the lovers, but you don't want to feel like you're isolated. You know, you want to feel like, Oh, this is the place I belong, you know, just

Michael Cirillo: 19:23

like our audience.

Paul J Daly: 19:27

Oh, my God again. I knew I knew Michael was cooking.

Michael Cirillo: 19:32

Let me ask you this, because our human nature tends to ruin everything. Right? So we have this conversation. You know, I grew up I have four sisters, no brothers. I have four sister in laws. And so the minute I said I do I went from four to eight. And that just felt so normal to me because of how my upbringing so in some ways, it's difficult for me to understand why this is even an issue because I'm Like, okay, on the flip side, I understand why it's an issue and I understand what you're saying, how do we make it normal and not ruined? Here's what I mean by that, because you're going to have some dealership who wants to implement all of this and says, This is a great idea, and then they're gonna overcompensate, you're gonna be like, you know, you're, you're, you're such a great mechanic for you know, for human, you know, they're, they're gonna, like overcompensate everything, which makes it even more uncomfortable. How do we encourage people that like, just just can you be normal?

Hilary Haron: 20:37

I mean, holy, that's a that's a whole episode in and of itself. But and I actually think that that, for me, ties into like, a whole mental health care thing. But I think it starts at home, it's the way that we talk to our kids, it's the way that we encourage our kids to talk to other people, it's way that they see us interact with people, even when we're uncomfortable. And it's partially calling people out when you see it. You know, we're doing a board training on I don't know, sexual harassment, it's being like, I'm sorry, it's just really necessary. So you're telling me that like, this is still like a thing that people do? And I haven't heard anything about any broken noses. So you know, really? So I think,

Kyle Mountsier: 21:26

Oh, I think, yeah, that was good. I mean, I think, like we don't we don't run around off is breaking people's noses. But sexual harassment is still a thing. So this goes much deeper than I think why you're, you're talking about the vertical with your podcast is like, this goes much deeper than just how do you create an environment at the store? But how do you potentially, as an employer, go deeper and serve the like family narrative, or the human narrative of the people in your stores? Can you ask your chill,

Hilary Haron: 21:58

right? Like, like you said, you can't like overshoot it, but keep your chill. And think about how you would want to be treated. We're a pivotal generation, we're, we're like the shift. So what you guys are doing is, is saying that, look, this industry, that's amazing, that moves everybody around in a way that they want to move. We're also people, and we're humans with human needs and human wants and human desires, and we want to be treated fairly and normally. Like that, I think that's I think that's a big part of it.

Paul J Daly: 22:36

I agree. I know, I agree like that there is a shift going on, in this kind of like transitional generation that we're in right now. That for the first time ever, and I think some of this was brought upon us by market forces and things like Carvana, you know, coming to the market, and like bringing the conversation to the surface, right and saying it's okay to talk about it. And what has happened is a lot of dealers have come out of the woodwork saying like, yeah, customers shouldn't feel like that. Like, we should be embarrassed that customers think that about our industry, and we should do something about it. So without a doubt, like, this is the generation where I think it will be different, like fast forward 10 years, I think the industry is fundamentally different. And the perception of it is fundamentally different because of the work that has been being done for like, I'll be a little gratuitous. And I'll say like 10 years ago to 10 years from now that like 20 year period as like a generation. I agree. This is this is it. 10 years from now, no one will look at the auto industry the same as they have.

Michael Cirillo: 23:34

Not only that, there's going to be a bunch of Evie chargers up on the hill as of right after this podcast. Anyway, Hillary coming back there. Hillary, so much fun with you on the show today. Tremendous conversation and to your point, and Paul, and like everything we're talking about this conversation needs to be happening more often so that it becomes the norm. So we want to thank you for joining us and bringing your wisdom to Auto Collabs today,

Hilary Haron: 24:00

I appreciate you guys. Thank you so much for having me.

Kyle Mountsier: 24:08

Sometimes when we get into a podcast, about seven minutes in all of our minds are blown. And we struggled to continue. I feel like that just happened. It was kind of like what will like how do we not just like show up on Capitol Hill every day. We'd love people more than you love cars shirts, walking around with, right? I mean, like, that's the narrative. That's the story that she's saying is, oh, no, no, they just don't realize that their humanity just don't know legitimacy and that there's reasons for why the business is done the way that's done. And if it gets changed in certain ways, it could seriously impact the actual real tangible buying experience, that there's there's still actually a lot of good and even though we know that there's things to fix and change. Yeah, for sure. It

Michael Cirillo: 24:56

reminded me of our mission so We do more than cars, which is to have meaningful conversations about topics that matter. Right? Like bad things happen when we don't have conversations. So like, let's actually have conversations that was just something that resonated with me as I was listening to her talk.

Paul J Daly: 25:14

I think there's a lot of like pockets in the industry with people like Hillary, who had have not been, like proponents or not proponents, but haven't been like, engaged in that level of advocacy. And I think everybody has the opportunity to do that on a regular basis, right? Like, you don't have to go to Washington, DC to do it. You don't have to be involved with your dealer association to that level. But the reality is, is we're all campaigning every single day, which is why we put it on a shirt, right? Because, I mean, Kyle, when you go to an airport with that shirt on how many times you

Kyle Mountsier: 25:51

get stuff five times every airport, like I love that I'm aligned with that. I like that. What are you doing? Why is that that way, without

Paul J Daly: 25:57

without a doubt, it's the last time where were we? I was I think it was a trip to the West Coast. Yeah, it was when we were going to NADA. And we were in, like one of the little transport vehicles in Vegas. And a couple of women were there. And they said, like, Oh, what's that? I realized they and I explained the shirt and explained the heart behind it. And I realized like, they live like 10 minutes from my house in Syracuse. They were actually on the combination of flights that we were on. And I was like, Man, my hometown doesn't know about this. And so it just kind of like lit that back up. Like we all advocate every single day for this industry. But you know, people like Hillary went all the way up to the hill. No pun intended, but we're gonna vote for her when she decides to run in 2024.

Michael Cirillo: 26:42

Well, yep, that time again.

Kyle Mountsier: 26:49

On behalf of myself, Michael Cirillo, and Paul J. Daly. We really hope you enjoyed this episode of Auto Collabs as much as we did. See you next time. Sign

Unknown: 26:58

up for our free and fun to read daily email for free shot of relevant news and automotive, retail media and pop culture. You can get it now@asotu.com That's ASOTU.com If you love this podcast, please leave us a review and share it with a friend. Thanks again for listening. We'll see you next time. Welcome to recording

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