"Charging" Forward (yes, that's an EV pun) with Elena Ciccotelli

Paul J Daly: 0:00

So for Christmas, my wife nailed it this year.

‍Unknown: 0:08

This is Auto Collabs

Paul J Daly: 0:10

in the stocking was a bunch of things that I just use in regular life, like duct tape clips, pretty close, like metal clamps to hold things to a workbench. And the only thing that was not like one of those functional utilitarian items, which I loved, was the Elon Musk biography by Walter Isaacson, the same guy that wrote like the Steve Jobs, one that's over my head here. And it's like 600 pages, 500 pages, but I got like 200 pages, and I realized something about EVs. And that is, it's a miracle that Tesla ever even made it. And now we're in this Oh, yeah. And now it's like, but to see it go from like this. And as an entrepreneur, entrepreneurs, we can appreciate this, the like, the hairline between, we're doing something really innovative, that everyone's gonna love. And we're about to go out of business. Like that experience. It was so rewarding to watch that happen for Elon Musk over and over. And no,

Kyle Mountsier: 1:05

this is what's crazy. They went public at a buck 38 a share in 2010. In 2020, they were under well, just at the start of 2,020/3. End of 220 19 is when they went over$20 a share. Now we're you know, they got this massive market cap, it's $250 a share, right?

Paul J Daly: 1:31

It was as high as 400 at one point, right.

Kyle Mountsier: 1:34

But that's that was a mean, that's nine years that it took for them to become like a legitimate thing.

Paul J Daly: 1:42

That's the thing when when I was reading the book, and it has the date ranges for like Tesla, and by the way, like Elon Musk didn't start Tesla. Do you know this? No, he didn't. And the founders of the people that started it, and like the path that goes there and the partnerships, Toyota actually invested 50 million and Tesla at one point, like all the things that lead to the adoption, it's easy for us to think of it in terms of the last three to five years of being the real conversation, but oh my gosh, this conversation has been going on and happening and being drempt about for a decade, more, more than that. And so I don't know, it was just kind of one of those eye opening events that I thought I knew a lot of context. But there's so much more

Kyle Mountsier: 2:19

to the story. Well, it's like your wife knew that we were going to be recording our first podcast definitely

Paul J Daly: 2:24

thinking about that.

Kyle Mountsier: 2:27

With Elena check Itali of the EVS for everyone Podcast. I'm excited to have her on today. She's one of these like, just infectious personalities that I feel like she never doesn't smile. It which I don't know how that's possible be

Paul J Daly: 2:41

around or when the Eagles are playing. Oh, other side.

Unknown: 2:48

Right, of course, she's from Philly.

Paul J Daly: 2:49

So she is from Philly. I mean, Michaels from Dallas. Now,

Michael Cirillo: 2:53

I was just like, are you guys gonna let us talk to her or we're gonna get into this. We're

Paul J Daly: 2:59

just so much fun. We're gonna skip the interview and go right to the outro No, no, we're gonna get into this conversation. We know it's always a lively while with the latest chicken salad.

Elena Ciccotelli: 3:12

So tell us about your dad. Michael. My dad's from

Michael Cirillo: 3:16

Southern Italy.

Paul J Daly: 3:18

podcast host to be the guests.

Michael Cirillo: 3:20

You know what I didn't know until maybe five years ago that people in southern Italy technically they don't speak Italian. But they speak like when you go to Northern Italy like Rome where they speak Italian. Southern Italy is like this weird. Job jumbled up like weird dialect that they? I mean, it's Italian but it's not really Italian. So my dad's from Italy. My mom's from Portugal. You know what this means? This means the Italian in me wants everything the best money can buy. I want the 85 inch Sony TV. The Portuguese in me wants it for $0 or less.

Elena Ciccotelli: 4:01

You know? That's you should probably do an ad for the real real then you should be like you guys should do a collab

Michael Cirillo: 4:14

standing conflicted in a Best Buy. I'm like

Paul J Daly: 4:19

oh my gosh. I don't know. Please excuse the shenanigans you kind of knew what to expect. Know you kind of kind of showed up for the show, didn't you?

Elena Ciccotelli: 4:27

I showed up for the show. I you know what I feel like I won the golden ticket. Like I unwrapped to the Wonka bar. I got the golden ticket like Charlie and the Chocolate Factory vibes right now. Because you guys know I'm super fans of what you do. So

Paul J Daly: 4:47

that goes both ways. And just so we can make sure everybody understands what you're up to these days. Give us the quick summary because I love your content. I love the podcast, you're getting super creative with like, let's pile a bunch of people. fill in a car and go for a ride or backward

Kyle Mountsier: 5:01

in my podcasts of the year 2023.

Paul J Daly: 5:04

Give us an FYI.

Kyle Mountsier: 5:06

Have you watched? Oh my god. I mean, I've listened to a lot of podcasts. I you know, like, watch this one, you know, smartlace is out there in the world and that podcast at use car week with Igor and Jimmy and you like, I think John Foley was in there, too. Oh, they were all in.

Elena Ciccotelli: 5:27

But you know what the thing is, uh, Scott Case from recurrent? The case? You know, so, listen, that episode was, I just said I want to talk about and really, this is the theme of the show, I want to see who you are as a person, right? We come to work, we come to events. And we are obviously we're putting our best foot forward. But it's also like, Paul, who are you as a person? Michael, we had a very nice conversation about your father. So like, I want to get those bits about what you did and what you're about. Because then yeah, we can talk about electric vehicles, we can talk about EVs. But I feel that people want to get to know you. They want to get to know what you're about. And you guys do this so well. Just in all the content you create, and all of the the community that you've built, and just all the things that you do. And I think there there needs to be more of that in the auto industry. And I'm just happy to play.

Kyle Mountsier: 6:31

We completely agree. First of all, we are shorter. Okay, so but here's, here's what's interesting to me. And I think the way that you position that specifically around EVs, because we know as in auto, at least internally, there's been this we we feel and the reason why this podcast is Auto Collabs. There's this, this almost sense that there's there's four different types of personas, and they're all against each other, right OEMs and industry partners and dealers and consumers are all butting heads. And so we just feel like it would be better if they came together. And then there's this there's almost this like new entrant into the space, which is anybody that puts Evie anywhere near there. It's like, anywhere near their title, or their job description or things that they do, as well as just the car that is the Eevee. And so we just reject any personification of like that. That personhood. Do you feel that? That's that's like a reality that you're expected?

Paul J Daly: 7:38

This is a therapy book? Yeah, very much personification of the personhood, um, like, two, three, which is the real me.

Elena Ciccotelli: 7:48

The thing is, Kyle is I understood what you said, so it was smarter than me. Yeah, it was articulated beautifully. And the sad fact is, is that this is such a polarizing topic. And you guys know this and being in media. Yeah, it kind of helps to have a polarizing topic as the topic of your show. It's just

Paul J Daly: 8:09

right, frankly, so

Elena Ciccotelli: 8:12

but at the same time, there's gotta be, there's gotta be a way forward, you guys keep saying keep pushing back. I say keep charging forward. Like there's there's that there's a path

Unknown: 8:25

somewhere. And the word charge of that too. Right. So

Elena Ciccotelli: 8:32

So I think there there are, yes, Kyle, there are a lot of people that are very passionate, I would say in one direction. And then there's the 180 degree passion in the other direction. I just want to report on what's happening. And what's interesting, and, and also getting the story behind the folks that are doing something a little bit differently. So I'll just give you a quick example. So I had this woman's name is Natalie King, she has a charging manufacturing company, and she is building commercial grade chargers in Detroit. And I had her on the show because I said Natalie not a lot of people know about you like you've done all these amazing things she worked in solar and now pivoted over to so the, the, the opportunity and electric vehicles. She's using a lot of the community in Detroit as her workforce, and has this like really holistic approach to it. So there's there's really cool inspiring people doing really neat things in the community around electric vehicles. So I want to shine a light on maybe some of the more lesser known things that are happening almost like the guy theory of like, electric vehicles. I mean, I know I probably not going to talk about flavortown on the show, but I You know, in that same kind of way of, hey, let's have a conversation. What are the cool things that you're up to? And yeah, we'll talk about electric vehicles. And first

Kyle Mountsier: 10:10

of all, I got a new show for you before I asked my question, because all of these EVs are getting installed at like restaurants and gas stations across the country, you should actually like merge flavortown and be charging network somehow into his show. It would be amazing. Okay, so And Kyle,

Elena Ciccotelli: 10:29

you you guys have to be the first guests then. Okay, can we just say like, let's,

Kyle Mountsier: 10:35

let's go. I've been trying to do a travel show.

Michael Cirillo: 10:43

You know, what intrigues me about this is that you can actually make a whole show about Tesla's it's the craziest thing.

Elena Ciccotelli: 10:51

The craziest thing, you could absolutely do a whole show about Tesla's and oh, that's

Michael Cirillo: 10:55

how your shows about I saw EV not just

Kyle Mountsier: 11:00

here's my real question. Go back to the beginning. Because you talked about these inspiring people. You've done a couple of different podcasts in the past, you've worked for some large companies, you've had your own startups, why the switch in the move to delving into specifically communications about Evie, where did that come from? Where did that passion begin?

Elena Ciccotelli: 11:20

It really came from I think my So really my time at Lyft, I think was kind of a big eye opener for me. And that's where I met you guys. I know, I was still working at Lyft, who I had the first ASOTU CON and Philly. I know, I was

Paul J Daly: 11:35

like she's from Philly, we're in.

Elena Ciccotelli: 11:39

So with that, that whole experience really kind of made me take a second look and really get into the partnership aspect. Like really my role there was business development and partnership development. And I prior will actually simultaneously while I was at Lyft. This also dovetails into a pretty funny story. I started a podcast was called the side gig central podcast. It had nothing to do with automotive, it was purely like, let's talk about your startup. And let's talk about like, guerilla marketing tactics that you can use on a shoestring budget, because I'm all about bootstrapping. So I did the show. And in the course of launching the show, I wrote this garbage press release, it was absolute garbage. I thought, you know, I, at the time, it was 2019 Taylor Swift just released an album. And I put in there like, you know, side gigs or the new economy, and I was, you know, the assault Z authority from Lyft. And I was keyword stuffing. I was like delivery rideshare you know, sustainability and like all

Paul J Daly: 12:47

transparency with us. So I,

Elena Ciccotelli: 12:50

so I submitted the press release, I then was asked by chatter business to do an interview on the floor of the New York Stock Exchange to talk about the sagging economy.

Unknown: 13:00

Okay. You're like, Oh, crap.

Elena Ciccotelli: 13:04

I will send you the link to this. And so I did two episodes, guys. Like I didn't even when people say like, oh, I'm afraid to get started. I did this press release with I had one episode done like it. It was all just smoke and mirrors.

Paul J Daly: 13:24

We're gonna pretend that we've never done

Elena Ciccotelli: 13:28

so it was it was the wildest thing but that Okay, so to what happened with that podcast. So it's currently in the podcast graveyard, but I'm thinking about resurrecting it, you know, in a different way, but maybe rebooting it. But I've been just so busy because EVs for everyone just like the momentum of this show is way beyond what I was doing before. So anyway, the reason why to answer your original question, Kyle, the reason why I'm like now all in doing the show is number one, I love it. This is truly my passion. I love the not only the people aspect of it, but it's also to being able to put on a show, like I know this is gonna sound really cool, is gonna sound really corny. But like when you have a podcast, it is truly a show and yes, you are entertaining. But then you're also yes, you bring forward information, but people want to be excited about consuming your content. And again, like I keep going back to you guys do this really, really well and understand this. There's only a couple of people I think in automotive that truly understand what that's about. And so that gets me really excited. Meeting new people the potential of doing a Guy Fieri podcast for EVs will chargers at different, you know, different bikinis or like whatever. So I think from the experience that I did it at Lyft was really one of those things where I was alright, well, I can stay, I can stay comfortable in corporate, or I could really follow and carve this own path that I got going on right now.

Paul J Daly: 15:12

Well, we're super glad that you entered this space because it is it is good to have other people that kind of have the same DNA, the people who are ready to do it, the people who are actually Eagles fans have said that in their colleagues, oh, we can't do it with you. Well, that's exactly it. You can't do anything about it. That's the problem. You can't do. It's a life sentence. So

Michael Cirillo: 15:37

Eagles fans because Taylor Swift isn't dating anybody on that team yet,

Paul J Daly: 15:41

actually is Taylor Swift is an Eagles fan. That's the funny part. Like people are starting to say like since she and Travis Kelce started dating, right? The Chiefs have done terrible and people are like, Oh, it was her intention all along to scuttle the team.

Michael Cirillo: 15:53

You're like, yeah, that's her intention. She could buy the team. And really if she wanted to go to London, Canada. Yeah.

Paul J Daly: 16:03

London, Canada. I have a serious question, though. Why is it Nick Sirianni? Running quarterback sneak? I'm just kidding. That was.

Michael Cirillo: 16:16

I don't know. I might have zoned out though. A little bit earlier. The show that you did from the New York Stock Exchange. When did you say you're reviving that on the ASOTU network?

Elena Ciccotelli: 16:27

Oh my gosh, when? Series. Next me well, we'll figure out a time. But we can Yeah, let's chat. Let's have a conversation about it. Like look, nothing is off the table right now.

Paul J Daly: 16:44

I have a question about dealer sentiment, and Ed so you kind of get the advantage of having a hand in all the different segments like Evie drivers, industry partners, the charging the dealership world obviously, with the events that we go to. I've heard a lot of sentiments from dealers, some seem to be very anti evey because of things manufacturers are held, forcing them to do. Other dealers are very pro Evie. And they're doing everything they can to adopt it. And then there's like this middle group who are like, Hey, I'm all for it. We just have to have the right things in place to adopt it. What pushback primarily do you get when you talk to dealers about EVs? Like what's the top thing that dealers are like? This is why I don't think it's a good idea.

Elena Ciccotelli: 17:31

Ya know, and like you said, it is very much a divided topic. And, you know, we got credit is tightening, you know, trade ins are, you know, upside down and like record highs, you know, Evie, inventory is creeping up there. Right. And so, I, that's a lot of pushback. Right. And that just that Garner's a lot of just a feeling of these are uncharted waters, not really 100% Sure. But at the end of the day, I think and, Paul, I might actually go back to something that you said at the year end extravaganza, your your final thought, do you remember what you said at the end about how this is this is going to be the year where substance is going to take this is the year where folks are going to be like, do you have the substance? Do you have the creativity? Do you have the wherewithal to maybe explore something a little bit different and get creative? And I couldn't? I think

Paul J Daly: 18:38

it's also having the depth to back it up. Right? Not just to like, say, I'm going to wait out there, but it's actually what's, what's it tethered to?

Elena Ciccotelli: 18:46

Right? Yeah, no, absolutely. And so, you know, I know you, you guys have your your finger on the pulse of dealers. And I know that you probably know you. I feel like you would know one or two dealers that that are either in the pro or Yeah, absolutely. I feel like you guys would know a couple of people.

Paul J Daly: 19:07

All the way I will say this about about that comment. We do have lots of dealership relationships between the three of us, right? It's easily in the hundreds of personal relationships. And I will say that the dealers who seem to be the most progressive and successful not just the ones dreaming it up, but the ones actually backing it up with sound execution across the board, not in EVs or ice, but fixed ops, you know, sales service, all the things seem to be leaning in on EVs, and if it's not sales, it's definitely preparation and education. And Kyle's nodding Cirilo is just standing there. He's just got us on a camera loop. He's not actually on the call anymore.

Elena Ciccotelli: 19:49

Yeah, here, he's here. I'll jump in real quick and comment on that. So I had Matt Jones from TrueCar was one of the interviews I did It also used car week, and I love what he said, and I have to give him credit for this quote, I cannot take credit for it. He said, I know we always got to talk about more easy education, more education, more education, he was like, no, these consumers are very educated, you know, they're gonna know, like, down to the, to the kilowatt hour or so charging is like, they need an EP action plan. And I was like, like, you just say, like, that was such a, like, a brilliant thing to say, because I think he's, he's right. You know, the back to your point, Paul, about that, you know, having people having people at the dealership feel like this is something that they can say like, yeah, I feel comfortable selling this. Now, there's the other issue of like, let's align on like, How much am I getting paid to actually sell this Eevee. And again, I was listening very closely again, at the the year end extravaganza, I was like, what are they going to sell it? Say about EVs? And if some people are like, don't force EVs on other people, I was like, oh, message received, right. So to, to see, your I think it's like,

Kyle Mountsier: 21:18

the general, the general sentiment that I'm getting is, is I haven't heard, there are there are a small pocket of dealers that are like, forgetting views. We're never doing that, right. But by enlarge, and as evidenced by a new friend of ours that got 4000 signatures, that the whole letter to the administration was not, don't bring EVs it was let's do it better. Right. But that they're that we see this as a future, we see this as something that's coming. But let's make sure that we're doing it better do it better for the consumer better for the OEM better for the dealer, better for, you know, like the infrastructure. And I think that that's the, that's the probably the point that that is probably is hopefully going to be driven home, through the dealer network to consumers is, hey, here's the better option. Here's the better way, here's the action plan. Here's how you can go from your gas powered vehicle, to a hybrid to an to a plug in, you know, plug in hybrid to an Eevee. And feel comfortable about the transition. And if you're in an apartment complex and you want an Eevee, what does it look like for you to charge that vehicle in different locations, like here are ways that we can educate you on your ownership, and not just your your purchase? Which, which, which will drive retention in the end? Actually, it's a massive opportunity. This is premium here.

Michael Cirillo: 22:46

Yeah, you are? Yeah, we're

Kyle Mountsier: 22:49

preaching. I apologize, what you're putting down, but the whole thing is like, now we have an opportunity at retention that we haven't had for a long time, because we now will be if we become the source, then retention is potentially a lot easier because of the changeover in the type of vehicle. Right?

Michael Cirillo: 23:08

Do you think genuinely this January? Do you think we hurt the whole Evie narrative by coming out of the gate so strong on the environmental play? Right, because that's where we started. It was like, We got to save the environment. And then now you have dissenters who are like, but have you seen how much cobalt in the mining process and bla bla bla bla bla bla, like, do you think we should have just came out of the gate saying, here's a different way to drive a vehicle?

Paul J Daly: 23:46

It wouldn't have gotten off, I think it wouldn't have gotten off the ground? Because that's how government money got involved. No, no, you're not you're not getting you're not getting federal funding, just to see if we can have a better way to drive a car. I'm

Michael Cirillo: 23:59

genuinely curious. Curious, because you're right, that kind of caused a narrative. And so

Paul J Daly: 24:06

I'll tell you what, I am 200 pages into the Elon Musk book. Yeah. And it has totally changed my perspective, fully on the synthesis of EVs, how they came to be why they came to be, and I don't think that why we started is why we're going to finish. I think that EVs overall may have started and the funding and like the, the higher the higher level purpose of Let's get off of rely, well, some people was different. Some people said, Let's do it because it's bad for the environment. And there were a lot of people that said, it's bad to be that dependent on an energy source that isn't produced. Here in the US. I think that was also a big driver. It was energy security and people saying that's a source of a lot of overseas conflict is fighting over the oil. And I think like all of that got mashed up. I think at this point, where we are right now, EVs are going to slowly become more adapted. And it's not an either or I think it's going to be a both end world. But at the same time, I think the reason they're going to continue to be adopted is because they actually are really great to drive. And they actually are real convenient. And Steve Mansfield said it in his thing this morning, he's like, the shift gears going on from people looking at a car from something you buy and put gas into something you plug in, like your phone, and a device. And like, to me, it practically makes sense as soon as some of the infrastructure catches up. So I don't think the reason we started is the reason we're gonna finish. Now

Elena Ciccotelli: 25:30

that and that's so well put, and I think also to, like, people want to be able to afford a vehicle. Like,

Paul J Daly: 25:36

yeah, right. Like, that's always the driving factor in the car. Right.

Elena Ciccotelli: 25:40

Yeah, exactly. And then so I think also, too, what's kind of cool about talking to all of these different areas of the Evie ecosystem is that it is, it's, it's like an octopus, there's so many tentacles and so many different stakeholders. It's, it's almost like you have to, like hurt. I know, we say herd the cats a lot. And if like auto retail, it's, it's herd the cats times 1000 With with Eevee, right? Because Never before have you had you know, such like restriction regulation, mandates, all of the things that you know, as dealers as entrepreneurs are like, ah, what is what is this? Right? This is not, you know, business as usual. This this is something this is a different animal. This is a different beast, but at the same time, is it really? Okay, so, right, you know, so it gets it gets a little bit creative, but at the same time, this is the reason why I wanted to do this show because I love getting dynion.

Paul J Daly: 26:54

And when there are a lot of opinions, there's a lot of listeners, we have to ask the question that everyone really wants to know. Do you drive an Eevee?

Elena Ciccotelli: 27:02

I do. Yes, I do. And I actually I don't I don't drive a Tesla. I drive a Chevy Bolt, Evie. And wow. Yeah.

Michael Cirillo: 27:11

Other electric vehicles.

Elena Ciccotelli: 27:14

Actually, other ones other than a Tesla. But yes, the answer is yes. I was like, Look, I gotta walk the walk right? I mean, that that would not make sense whatsoever. But hey, it's a great car. I you know, like so many of us here work from home, so it suits me for what I needed to do and I don't know I like it. Shout out to Mary Barra. Cool. I like my

Paul J Daly: 27:40

go. The real question is do you use CarPlay? Oh,

Elena Ciccotelli: 27:46

question actually, I don't even really I don't even really plug in my phone like I'm kind of an

Unknown: 27:51

Oh, so she doesn't

Elena Ciccotelli: 27:54

know actually I guess the car

Michael Cirillo: 27:57

flaps open the eject on her Sony Walkman cassette

Elena Ciccotelli: 28:03

oh my gosh, Michael is roasting these opens

Paul J Daly: 28:06

up the 15 CD folder he's supposed

Kyle Mountsier: 28:09

to do about Tesla's now Sony likes you That means he liked your work.

Elena Ciccotelli: 28:17

I thought we had a nice thing going where we are a conversation about Italy now you're roasting me?

Michael Cirillo: 28:24

Hey, well, to be fair, my own father. The earliest compliment I can remember from my own father was a wow you look funny when you sleep that's what I knew he loved me

Kyle Mountsier: 28:42

because he was watching us leave.

Unknown: 28:47

Portal. What's your story?

Kyle Mountsier: 28:50

I bet too well laid out we have had I like I think we all could have an hour long podcast at this point. But we've run out of time on Auto Collabs it's time people are going to have to head over to EVs for everyone it's EVs the number four everyone.com You can find that they you should you should go listen to that. If you're not already subscribe, mash that button like it all over for her. And thank you so much for joining us on Auto Collabs it's been a pleasure.

Elena Ciccotelli: 29:16

Oh, thank you Kyle. Paul. Michael this has been amazing and we absolutely need to do a follow up at NADA I know you're going crazy at NADA but we need to can we just go and get breakfast and that'd be the episode The nominally spectacular

Michael Cirillo: 29:39

Okay, well I did notice since the intro,

Kyle Mountsier: 29:44

how many how many jokes you can toss at someone or how much shade you can throw?

Paul J Daly: 29:49

I think if we had a shape counter, like it'd be like this.

Michael Cirillo: 29:53

No, I thought what an endearing individual but what I was really thinking about was as you had mentioned, all of the things you use in daily life in your stocking. Before this conversation, you brought up the beautiful segue into our conversation with Lena. Did your wife passively aggressively put any everyday items that she believes you should use in the stocking? That's

Paul J Daly: 30:18

a great question. And no, she didn't. And she also like, it's almost like, to her chagrin, she puts in items that would require me to do something else. Because she knows that my propensity is to just go get into something. And so she just, she loves me, what can I say? She knows me. And she loves me.

Unknown: 30:39

So there was gorilla tape and my stalking,

Michael Cirillo: 30:41

you know what really, I really enjoy just aside from Elena's infectious kind of happiness, which I love. The day and age we live in where there were who's the futurist that said, we are experiencing basically 100 years of advancement in technology every five years I can't remember

Paul J Daly: 31:02

his name but he was like so futuristic like Warren Buffett realize that

Michael Cirillo: 31:06

yes, and and here we are today speaking to an individual who has enough subject matter to talk about Evie, like we are in the Jetsons time period guys. That she that there is enough to talk about EVs going on, like it is crazy to me. It's exciting to me. It's like Mazel Tov to her podcast. But imagine the Insight she's getting, like the undercurrent of insights that she's getting similar to your book about real mosque

Paul J Daly: 31:35

for real, or real. I mean, yeah, think about that. Like we existed before the phones did. Three of us mostly. And the cell phones, the cell, that's what I met. Yeah, not

Michael Cirillo: 31:49

pagers the other day. They were like what I love.

Paul J Daly: 31:52

I love talking about pages. I have all kinds of pages, stories, vehicles

Michael Cirillo: 31:57

that are powered by batteries. Yep, the end. And they're so fun to drive. The car

Kyle Mountsier: 32:04

fun to drive. I'll give you that all day every day.

Michael Cirillo: 32:08

So far. Well, hey, you got to check out

Kyle Mountsier: 32:11

Linnaeus podcast. We'll probably have her on again because there was too much fun. And on behalf of myself, Michael Cirillo, and Paul J. Daly. Thanks for joining us on Auto Collabs today, sign

Unknown: 32:22

up for our free and fun to read daily email for a free shot of relevant news in automotive, retail media and pop culture. You can get it now@asotu.com That's ASOTU.com If you love this podcast, please leave us a review and share it with a friend. Thanks again for listening. We'll see you next time. Welcome to recording